China - 5 Zhu - Wen - Southern Dynasties

I have few coins which I believe are Chen dynasty 5 zhu coins as mentioned on Gratzer - Fishman book named One thousand years of Wu Zhu Coinage, B8.31. These coins have inner and outer rim on both sides. 

This coin is on Numista: N#248642.

Numista coin is Hartill 10.22 and Hartill book says that it has no obverse inner rim, as mentioned also on coins information. 

My question: Which Hartill code is my coin and should we add it on Numista, because I think we don't have that here.

Mine is this one:  

Also according to Zeno.ru, that coin type is Chen Wu Zhu coin (Chen Dynasty 557-589).

My coin: 4.3 grams and 25.9 mm.

Hello Olli

I think that Hartill did not reference this coin

The allocation period is good in accordance with what I read in François Thierry's book

So  you could add it with the Gratzer-Fishman attribution 

and maybe it will be in a third version of Hartill 

Hi,

Actually such type is included in 2nd Edition of Hartill (see #10.17A). 

I have already created a page in September last year but still under review.

N#339106

Bear in mind there are arguments regarding to attribution for such type.

Chris

LCW1991

Hi,

 

Actually such type is included in 2nd Edition of Hartill (see #10.17A). 

 

I have already created a page in September last year but still under review.

N#339106

 

Chris

Hi Chris

you're right I passed by

LCW1991

 

 

Bear in mind there are arguments regarding to attribution for such type.

 

Chris

Hi Chris

Can you, please,devellop about the arguments of the attribution of this type

(Sorry for my poor english) 

G

Sorry Chris but I disagree. Based on Gratzer book I mentioned earlier, Liang Dynasty coins measure 22.5 to 23.0 mm, while Chen Dynasty Wu Zhu of type B8.31 measure 24.0 to 25.2 mm. As you can see my coin measure as much as 25.9 mm. So I still believe, based on Kratzer and Zeno that my coin is Chen Dynasty coin and thus not #10.17A. I would love to hear more arguments regarding that type.

Hi,

I believe Gratzer adopted information from Dong Deyi 董德義 as the information stated is match with the book Zhongguo qianbi dacidian 中國錢幣大辭典, vol. III

However, Doo Wai-San 杜維善, Wuzhu tukao 五株圖考 stated that the four specimens of Tianjian 5 Zhu (Lian Dynasty) had diameter ranged from 24.1-25.2mm, weight from 1.78g - 3.19g.

In my opinion it is hard and not accurate enough to conclude attribution, solely based on diameter and weight.

Chris

BTW Happy Chinese New Year

Thank you Chris. I'll have to take that into account. As I don't speak or read Chinese I just have to trust those English language books and web-sites. 

Happy Chinese New Year,

Olli

Chris, if you have or know a good book regarding Chinese coins and that is in English language, I would appreciate to know. I do have Hartill and Kratzer books in addition to older Fisher.

Olli

Ollisaarinen

Chris, if you have or know a good book regarding Chinese coins and that is in English language, I would appreciate to know. I do have Hartill and Kratzer books in addition to older Fisher.

Olli

 

Hi Olli,

Certainly. I'm glad to share if I find any. 

Chris